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GLI
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 Posted: June 28th, 2010 Post subject: Smoke'n'Stun |
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[Previously on Development Updates]
| Christian Knudsen wrote: | | [cut]there was an issue with the player being able to stand next to an open door and throw grenades through it without the characters on the other side being able to do anything because their tiles weren't visible. The code is now a lot cleaner and that issue has been fixed. The tiles that are visible to the player is now tiles that are within the same area as the player or in an adjacent area with an open door in between. |
[Previously on Announcements]
| Christian Knudsen wrote: | | - Reworked how tile visibility is determined. |
Oh, yeah! Rock'n'Roll!!! Now it's real hard to board hostile ship!
I disabled Gothri from random encounter (piece of cake, only one EMP torpedo) but when I tried board them in usual way then... they killed me when I was just in half of docking ramp (sic!). Say what?! 
I took "Join raid" mission against Kilrathi. My next attempt to board Gothri... was failure too. What's going on?! 
I decided to modify my tactics against Kamekh crew. I'm calling it "Smoke and Stun"... 
You can watch few movies I made (including "second failure") ([RS]/[MU]).
Now I'm looking for Kamekh... 
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Genuine Lifelike Individual
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Cthulhu
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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So you have a new tactics for Kamekh? Sweet, I was just thinking that this will make boarding of Kamekh impossible, but looking forward to watching your movies (if they offer a solution.  ).
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Damn! Kilrathies are fast and tough!
At last I managed how to board Kamekh now but first attempt was a failure (see movies: [RS]/[MU]).
First movie (029) is short  but second (030) is... boring.
After I stunned every Kilrathies on board I showed how Kamekh looks inside.
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Christian Knudsen
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Genuine Lifelike Individual
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VincentFirePony
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Dramatic... rabbit? Lol
_________________
There are only a few good things in life: AS, AS, beer, Minecraft and Hostile Takeover! A<0>V
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Christian Knudsen
Administrator
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| Posted: June 29th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Haha! Awesome! That'll teach him to stay out of Sly's cookies! 
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Cthulhu
Ace
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| Posted: June 30th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Never underestimate the rabbit!
(Sorry for this the longish spam-post. I just had to...)
| Quote: |
[clop clop clop]
[whinny whinny]
GALAHAD: They're nervous, sire.
ARTHUR: Then we'd best leave them here and carry on on foot. Dis-mount!
TIM: Behold the cave of Caerbannog!
ARTHUR: Right! Keep me covered.
GALAHAD: What with?
ARTHUR: W-- just keep me covered.
TIM: Too late!
[dramatic chord]
ARTHUR: What?
TIM: There he is!
ARTHUR: Where?
TIM: There!
ARTHUR: What, behind the rabbit?
TIM: It is the rabbit!
ARTHUR: You silly sod!
TIM: What?
ARTHUR: You got us all worked up!
TIM: Well, that's no ordinary rabbit.
ARTHUR: Ohh.
TIM: That's the most foul, cruel, and bad-tempered rodent you ever set eyes
on.
ROBIN: You tit! I soiled my armor I was so scared!
TIM: Look, that rabbit's got a vicious streak a mile wide; it's a killer!
GALAHAD: Get stuffed!
TIM: He'll do you up a treat mate!
GALAHAD: Oh, yeah?
ROBIN: You mangy scots git!
TIM: I'm warning you!
ROBIN: What's he do, nibble your bum?
TIM: He's got huge, sharp-- eh-- he can leap about-- look at the bones!
ARTHUR: Go on, Bors. Chop his head off!
BORS: Right! Silly little bleeder. One rabbit stew comin' right up!
TIM: Look!
[squeak]
BORS: Aaaugh!
[dramatic chord]
[clunk]
ARTHUR: Jesus Christ!
TIM: I warned you!
ROBIN: I done it again!
TIM: I warned you, but did you listen to me? Oh, no, you knew it all, didn't
you? Oh, it's just a harmless little bunny, isn't it? Well, it's always
the same. I always tell them--
ARTHUR: Oh, shut up!
TIM: Do they listen to me?
ARTHUR: Right!
TIM: Oh, no...
KNIGHTS: Charge!
[squeak squeak squeak]
KNIGHTS: Aaaaugh!, Aaaugh!, etc.
ARTHUR: Run away! Run away!
KNIGHTS: Run away! Run away!...
TIM: Ha ha ha ha! Ha haw haw! Ha! Ha ha!
ARTHUR: Right. How many did we lose?
LAUNCELOT: Gawain.
GALAHAD: Ector.
ARTHUR: And Bors. That's five.
GALAHAD: Three, sir.
ARTHUR: Three. Three. And we'd better not risk another frontal assault.
That rabbit's dynamite.
ROBIN: Would it help to confuse it if we run away more?
ARTHUR: Oh, shut up and go and change your armor.
GALAHAD: Let us taunt it! It may become so cross that it will make a mistake.
ARTHUR: Like what?
GALAHAD: Well... ooh.
LAUNCELOT: Have we got bows?
ARTHUR: No.
LAUNCELOT: We have the Holy Hand Grenade.
ARTHUR: Yes, of course! The Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch! 'Tis one of the
sacred relics Brother Maynard carries with him! Brother Maynard! Bring up
the Holy Hand Grenade!
MONKS: [chanting] Pie Iesu domine, dona eis requiem. Pie Iesu domine, dona
eis requiem. Pie Iesu domine, dona eis requiem. Pie Iesu domine, dona eis
requiem.
ARTHUR: How does it, um-- how does it work?
LAUNCELOT: I know not, my liege.
ARTHUR: Consult the Book of Armaments!
BROTHER MAYNARD: Armaments, Chapter Two, verses Nine to Twenty-one.
SECOND BROTHER: And Saint Attila raised the hand grenade up on high, saying,
'O Lord, bless this thy hand grenade that with it thou mayest blow thine
enemies to tiny bits, in thy mercy.' And the Lord did grin, and the people
did feast upon the lambs and sloths and carp and anchovies and orangutans
and breakfast cereals and fruit bats and large chu--
MAYNARD: Skip a bit, Brother.
SECOND BROTHER: And the Lord spake, saying, 'First shalt thou take out the
Holy Pin. Then, shalt thou count to three, no more, no less. Three shalt
be the number thou shalt count, and the number of the counting shall be
three. Four shalt thou not count, nor either count thou two, excepting
that thou then proceed to three. Five is right out. Once the number
three, being the third number, be reached, then lobbest thou thy Holy Hand
Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in my sight, shall
snuff it.'
MAYNARD: Amen.
KNIGHTS: Amen.
ARTHUR: Right! One... two... five!
GALAHAD: Three, sir!
ARTHUR: Three!
[angels sing]
[boom]
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http://www.textfiles.com/media/SCRIPTS/grail
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GLI
Ace
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Cthulhu
Ace
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| Posted: June 30th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Arrghh, how can I watch youtube from a text-based browser....
(it's the only way to live: SPEED!)
But I assume it's the scene above...
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VincentFirePony
Ace
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| Posted: June 30th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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One my favorite parts from that movie  Lets see Sly get past that one! lol
_________________
There are only a few good things in life: AS, AS, beer, Minecraft and Hostile Takeover! A<0>V
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VincentFirePony
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Back on topic: I just boarded a Dralthi and just like you said the inside of the enemy ship is visible about halfway across the docking ramp. So it looks like I might have to employ the smoke & stun/shoot/grenade technique.
And also, when I attacked the Kilrathi with my M-47, I remembered one of the changes CK made with three shot weapons.
I both like and dislike it. It took two rounds of firing to kill the Kilrathi.
I aimed at his head and "pulled" the trigger, one of the three shots missed the first time and two of three shots hits the second time. That usually wasn't the case when I was able to aim each of the three shots before and sometimes, if I'm facing more than one opponent, I'll split the shots between them.
CK: How do the mechanics of this change to firing work? Do they take skill level into account? Does moving the mouse still affect where subsequent shots land?
_________________
There are only a few good things in life: AS, AS, beer, Minecraft and Hostile Takeover! A<0>V
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rbfowler9
Rookie
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Watching movie 030, it seems quite unrealistic that a single guy with a stun rod is able to defeat a horde of heavily-armed and well trained kilrathi soldiers.
I credit that to the "single-tile-width" bridge, as the enemy queue in front of you, and only the first one may attack.
It's like in a Jackie Chan move: there are dozens of bad guys around him. But instead of attacking all at once, they choose to attack one by one, while the others just keep watching around...
Maybe a "double-tile-width" bridge would make things more realistic, since enemies would be able to take place in the tiles around you, so you'd have to deal with 5 attackers at once in the worst case....?
Edit: In that case, it'd be nice to be able to hire some mercenaries that board as passengers on your ship until your next landing, so you could call a "posse" and combat the enemy all at once, pretty much like in DrugLord, as we're talking text-mode games here.....
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Flyboy
Veteran
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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I dunno... why would they use a docking tube that was any larger than necessary? Especially since fighters are so small.
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Christian Knudsen
Administrator
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| VincentFirePony wrote: | | CK: How do the mechanics of this change to firing work? Do they take skill level into account? Does moving the mouse still affect where subsequent shots land? |
All three shots use the spot where you aimed at as the "starting off" point. Wobble is then applied based on your skill. So only what you do when doing the actual aiming affects where all three shots will land.
| rbfowler9 wrote: | | Watching movie 030, it seems quite unrealistic that a single guy with a stun rod is able to defeat a horde of heavily-armed and well trained kilrathi soldiers. |
Yeah, there are some improvements to the AI that I'll be implementing at some point that should address this. One being that enemies won't always rush towards you, but sometimes stay put and wait for you to come to them, so they won't all just queue up in the docking tube.
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| Christian Knudsen wrote: | | VincentFirePony wrote: | | CK: How do the mechanics of this change to firing work? Do they take skill level into account? Does moving the mouse still affect where subsequent shots land? |
All three shots use the spot where you aimed at as the "starting off" point. Wobble is then applied based on your skill. So only what you do when doing the actual aiming affects where all three shots will land. |
It's like "three-shot burst firing mode" for MP5 - when trigger will be pulled then shooter can't change aiming.
| Christian Knudsen wrote: | | rbfowler9 wrote: | | Watching movie 030, it seems quite unrealistic that a single guy with a stun rod is able to defeat a horde of heavily-armed and well trained kilrathi soldiers. |
Yeah, there are some improvements to the AI that I'll be implementing at some point that should address this. One being that enemies won't always rush towards you, but sometimes stay put and wait for you to come to them, so they won't all just queue up in the docking tube. |
Player should be able "to drag" captives to his/her ship instead of "transfer". During fight (e.g. with 11 Kilrathies) it looks a little bit strange when player "disappeared" cuffed opponent while 10 other "waits".
NPCs should be able to "avoid" stunned persons and captives (like player's character do). IMO stunned person is laying on a "ground" (and should drop anything held in hands).
AFAIK Kilrathies aren't "lone fighters" - since the very beginning of their race they're hunted in packs (in space they're acting alike). Maybe some "decoy/ambush" tactics for them?
_________________
Genuine Lifelike Individual
Last edited by GLI on July 1st, 2010; edited 1 time in total
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Cthulhu
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| rbfowler9 wrote: | | Edit: In that case, it'd be nice to be able to hire some mercenaries that board as passengers on your ship until your next landing, so you could call a "posse" and combat the enemy all at once, pretty much like in DrugLord, as we're talking text-mode games here..... |
Man, that would be awesome! Then you could have your own little extraction team.
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| rbfowler9 wrote: | | Watching movie 030, it seems quite unrealistic that a single guy with a stun rod is able to defeat a horde of heavily-armed and well trained kilrathi soldiers. |
Maybe player's character is well skilled too?
| rbfowler9 wrote: | | It's like in a Jackie Chan move: there are dozens of bad guys around him. But instead of attacking all at once, they choose to attack one by one, while the others just keep watching around... |
I heard that "Assassin's Creed" game has the same technique...
| rbfowler9 wrote: | | Edit: In that case, it'd be nice to be able to hire some mercenaries that board as passengers on your ship until your next landing, so you could call a "posse" and combat the enemy all at once, pretty much like in DrugLord, as we're talking text-mode games here..... |
Maybe we just need a crew that will fight with us? E.g. other capital ships have more then two NPCs on board. Maybe they could help a little:
- faster shooting turrets,
- faster working repair bot,
- boarding party,
- other?
_________________
Genuine Lifelike Individual
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Cthulhu
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| GLI wrote: | Maybe we just need a crew that will fight with us? E.g. other capital ships have more then two NPCs on board. Maybe they could help a little:
- faster shooting turrets,
- faster working repair bot,
- boarding party,
- other? |
Priest/Shepherd?
(I never understood what his function was on that ship.)
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Pellaeon
Experienced
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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Defensive droid?
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| Cthulhu wrote: | | GLI wrote: | Maybe we just need a crew that will fight with us? E.g. other capital ships have more then two NPCs on board. Maybe they could help a little:
- faster shooting turrets,
- faster working repair bot,
- boarding party,
- other? |
Priest/Shepherd?
(I never understood what his function was on that ship.) |
IMHO he was some kind of "alliance agent" but from different faction ("Have faith not war")...
EDIT: I forgot. He was such "agent" who looks for outsiders. If he finds them he checks are they good ("lives" with them) or evil (nobody saw them anymore).
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Last edited by GLI on July 1st, 2010; edited 1 time in total
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Bugamn
Experienced
I can have an avatar now! |
| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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- Protocol Droid,
- Furry co-pilot
- Old wise man with modern sword
- Copyright infrigiment lawyer;
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It came from ... behind.
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VincentFirePony
Ace
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| Posted: July 1st, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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| Christian Knudsen wrote: | VincentFirePony wrote: CK: How do the mechanics of this change to firing work? Do they take skill level into account? Does moving the mouse still affect where subsequent shots land?
All three shots use the spot where you aimed at as the "starting off" point. Wobble is then applied based on your skill. So only what you do when doing the actual aiming affects where all three shots will land.
All three shots use the spot where you aimed at as the "starting off" point. Wobble is then applied based on your skill. So only what you do when doing the actual aiming affects where all three shots will land. |
Ah gotcha, I'll have to check my pistol stats. Do those stats still accumulate points even when they're "maxed out"?
| Cthulhu wrote: | | Man, that would be awesome! Then you could have your own little extraction team. |
I do believe CK has this planned for later versions? Our own fleets and armies?
| GLI wrote: | | I heard that "Assassin's Creed" game has the same technique... |
Where did you hear such lies?  The guards/enemies would usually attack all at once, sometimes when you knock one away they will wait until you knock the next one away or until you turn your back to them. lol
_________________
There are only a few good things in life: AS, AS, beer, Minecraft and Hostile Takeover! A<0>V
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Bugamn
Experienced
I can have an avatar now! |
| Posted: July 2nd, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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I think I saw a comic at Control Alt Del depicting that behaviour, but that was about the second game. I haven't played either to really know.
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It came from ... behind.
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GLI
Ace
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| Posted: July 11th, 2010 Post subject: Re: Smoke'n'Stun |
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[Previously on Bug Reports]
I found new way for easy boarding enemy ship without risk of being shot in the middle of docking ramp - TRANSFER OF CAPTIVES!
I scooped, stunned and captured few pirates. When I disabled another pirate ship then I transfered my captives in hope to block hostile crew (see movies: [RS]/[MU]).
It works... even for Gothri. I flooded them!
IMHO Transfer of captives should be possible after every hostile crew member is killed or captured. Moreover NPCs should be able to avoid captives like player's character do.
Did I used captives as a "human shield"? Who, me?!
Next is Kamekh... 
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